Tom'sEa WPFX LIVE讨论

Hello everyone, I have not chimed in in a while and there have been several pages of comments and I have not read through them all but I though I would give you a general update. The EA is currently functioning as it should. Those that have reported large draw downs or margin calls were typically on 50.1 accounts with small deposits or just using to high of a RL on a 50.1 account. I have two accounts running 50.1 and both are fine. These accounts started with 7 to 8k in them and I am running Rl 2. The wpfx account is at about a 18% draw down and it is running 4 different pairs and both of the tradency accounts are ok and they are running 6 pairs.

For anyone that has experienced a margin call it is my guess that you were trading a smaller account. From the beginning we have told people that you could trade this EA with as little as 1k if you had 400.1 but it was not recommended. The more money you have up to a point any way the less risk you take. Once you exceed 10k there are not any advantages since it scales at every 10k.

I think sometimes what happens is people get excited and the hear about the money they can make and they gloss over the rest of what is said. In the moment they are willing to take the risk but when it becomes a reality its not a fun experience. We have definitely said that lower starting accounts are higher risk. We have also said that the guidelines set up are for 400.1 accounts and you should stay on the lower side of the guideline if you are trading 50.1. The EA does perform well and continues to. The market is running now and that is where it struggles and some patience is required.

Everyone needs to keep in mind that this is trading. There is risk involved even within the guidelines. There is no perfect system but so far TomsEA is the best most hands off system I have ever used. I honestly have not done anything to my accounts outside of check on them every few days. I have know way of knowing for sure that it will continue in this manner since I cant see into the future :) but I am optimistic. Our support staff remains available via email and chat from the members area and I hope to have the forum back up on the new site soon.

We are also introducing a program that will put some money back into your pocket and maybe help those of you that got caught in this swing be able to fund your accounts again. Just head the warning about using the correct RL. Remember that we are all in the same boat. I have a lot of money in the market being traded by Tomsea so its not like I am not vested in this thing and when draw downs occur I feel them to. Sometimes, like now, patience is a virtue... Have a great week guys and trade safe.

quick update... The live chat will be added back the members today and forum will be quick to follow.

   chrissav posted:
   Another .21 trade now opened on gbp ( basket now 1.06 in total now per pip). Has anyone else had a trade open?

Hi chrissav
I'm trading with GKFX on a SB account, so divide my 'lots' by 10, eg 2.10 equiv to 0.21.
I've had a 1.50 short opened on Cable at 1.58754 and the same on EUR/USD at 1.32551 today. I took profit on all the open 2.10 trades when the market RTd as I felt pretty exposed and wanted to bank the £300 or so that was on the table. All RLs had been reduced to 1, but these trades were opened at RL2, so I felt much better when they'd gone and I'd pocketed something for the risk.

By leaving the EA active, I figured that it would recalculate what it needed to do with the baskets at the (now) reduced RL of 1 once these trades had closed and would hedge up or trade down as it saw fit. Pretty much, this has been what it's been doing. The risk, of course, is if Cable (in particular) launches North to 1.6000/1.6100 and drags more older trades to their stops, along with these new trades. There's a risk of 2 trades in EuR/USD doing the same. At time of writing, stops are only 50/60 pips away on 3 trades of .20 (20p) and 120 pips on a .50(!) so the losses will start building if these pairs don't RT sometime soon. The other option is to turn the thing off and manually intervene on all of the riskier trades, but that kind of defeats the whole object of this. For my part, a hybrid of intervention and letting TEA do its thing is my preferred strategy (plus burning incense, getting the mat out, facing Mecca, throwing bones around a circle, etc,...) :)

Dunno if any of this helps at all, but I'm with Dustin on the account size at least, as this thing will turn at some point. I don't think £10k (or $10k) is necessary per pair in runs like we're experiencing currently, as some have indicated, but an account of at least £5k/$5k running RL1 on 3 pairs - especially where they're correlated - is probably a minimum until the EA is tweaked to allow us more control and intervention.

Useful of Dustin to check in earlier, and good news about the Live Chat / Forum, but still think a link to this discussion wouldn't hurt... There's some useful ideas and support floating around here for other members.

   PocketGuy posted:
   

   chrissav posted:
   Another .21 trade now opened on gbp ( basket now 1.06 in total now per pip). Has anyone else had a trade open?

Hi chrissav
I'm trading with GKFX on a SB account, so divide my 'lots' by 10, eg 2.10 equiv to 0.21.
I've had a 1.50 short opened on Cable at 1.58754 and the same on EUR/USD at 1.32551 today. I took profit on all the open 2.10 trades when the market RTd as I felt pretty exposed and wanted to bank the £300 or so that was on the table. All RLs had been reduced to 1, but these trades were opened at RL2, so I felt much better when they'd gone and I'd pocketed something for the risk.

By leaving the EA active, I figured that it would recalculate what it needed to do with the baskets at the (now) reduced RL of 1 once these trades had closed and would hedge up or trade down as it saw fit. Pretty much, this has been what it's been doing. The risk, of course, is if Cable (in particular) launches North to 1.6000/1.6100 and drags more older trades to their stops, along with these new trades. There's a risk of 2 trades in EuR/USD doing the same. At time of writing, stops are only 50/60 pips away on 3 trades of .20 (20p) and 120 pips on a .50(!) so the losses will start building if these pairs don't RT sometime soon. The other option is to turn the thing off and manually intervene on all of the riskier trades, but that kind of defeats the whole object of this. For my part, a hybrid of intervention and letting TEA do its thing is my preferred strategy (plus burning incense, getting the mat out, facing Mecca, throwing bones around a circle, etc,...) :)

Dunno if any of this helps at all, but I'm with Dustin on the account size at least, as this thing will turn at some point. I don't think £10k (or $10k) is necessary per pair in runs like we're experiencing currently, as some have indicated, but an account of at least £5k/$5k running RL1 on 3 pairs - especially where they're correlated - is probably a minimum until the EA is tweaked to allow us more control and intervention.

Useful of Dustin to check in earlier, and good news about the Live Chat / Forum, but still think a link to this discussion wouldn't hurt... There's some useful ideas and support floating around here for other members.

Like your thinking Pocketboy, especially the bones around the circle (LOL) Just going to find some now. I do agree with you but likewise i think you need at least 5k. I'm just going to let it ride but will keep a close eye on it as my account size is only £2200 or just over $3500. If i can get my account back to size it was when I started with Tomsea I might just do that and start again

A suggestion would be to take advantage of this decline to close some positions in profit. The decline will most likely continue and all will be well, but for those that want to sleep tonight :-) you might want to close out a few of the big 0.21 at a profit now.

If it goes back north at least the exposure is lower than it would. Mine is deactivated for the time being.

I took this opportunity to close nearly everything that is 0.15 or bigger on all accounts @ profit. (GBPUSD)

   GlobalProfit posted:
 For anyone that has experienced a margin call it is my guess that you were trading a smaller account. From the beginning we have told people that you could trade this EA with as little as 1k if you had 400.1 but it was not recommended. The more money you have up to a point any way the less risk you take. Once you exceed 10k there are not any advantages since it scales at every 10k.

Hi, Dustin
Could you please to elaborate some more about what you mean 'Once you exceed 10k there are not any advantages since it scales at every 10k.'
thanks
ss

   drsong123 posted:
Hi, Dustin
Could you please to elaborate some more about what you mean 'Once you exceed 10k there are not any advantages since it scales at every 10k.'
thanks
ss

Forgive for pitching in. If I understood right, lot sizes and risk calculations are the same from $100.00 to $10,000. Therefore 0.01 starting lot will be the same for everyone up to 10k. Above 10k and beyond, lot sizes change.

Therefore, if you have a $2000 account it will not behave any different to a $9000 account in terms or real lot sizes and real dollar amounts. When the 9k account has a 1k DD, so will the 2k account. Same.

However, with a 2k account, you will run out of margin much sooner than the 9k. Hence the recommendation to have higher leverage with smaller account.

Basically if you dont have it, borrow it 😉

   chrissav posted:
   

   Anton44 posted:
   

   lobotomy8 posted:
   this EA is very dangerous. BTW, how developer can claim trades are fully automated if you guys keep manually managing trades, trailing stop, TPs etc ??? If I buy a robot I do expect it to do this job

Why do you think this EA very dangerous? Could you explain that? And the trades are fully automated. If someone is manually managing trades they don't have faith in the system... 😄

Hi Anton

I feel this is only dangerous if you don't have enough capital of at least $10K, which when sold to us was conveniently left out of the marketing. Otherwise over the long term i feel for small gains this is a decent ea. All depends if you are happy to see a large DD for a .5% gain.
As mentioned original marketing email before purchase Dustin and developers suggested $2500 which is a joke.
Unsure whether the version 1.89 as traded differently from the 1.88, as all this coincides with losing the website etc..

Hi Crissav,

I don't fully agree with you on that, you can easily trade with a smaller account but you have to play it save and use for example only the EUR/USD to trade with and not all 6 pairs....

   Anton44 posted:
   

   chrissav posted:
   

   Anton44 posted:
   

   lobotomy8 posted:
   this EA is very dangerous. BTW, how developer can claim trades are fully automated if you guys keep manually managing trades, trailing stop, TPs etc ??? If I buy a robot I do expect it to do this job

Why do you think this EA very dangerous? Could you explain that? And the trades are fully automated. If someone is manually managing trades they don't have faith in the system... 😄

Hi Anton

I feel this is only dangerous if you don't have enough capital of at least $10K, which when sold to us was conveniently left out of the marketing. Otherwise over the long term i feel for small gains this is a decent ea. All depends if you are happy to see a large DD for a .5% gain.
As mentioned original marketing email before purchase Dustin and developers suggested $2500 which is a joke.
Unsure whether the version 1.89 as traded differently from the 1.88, as all this coincides with losing the website etc..

Hi Crissav,

I don't fully agree with you on that, you can easily trade with a smaller account but you have to play it save and use for example only the EUR/USD to trade with and not all 6 pairs....

Hi Anton

It's only my opinion. I agreed with you until current DD on gbp/usd. Only trading this one pair on setting one which left to it's own devices may bust a $3500 account with leverage of 1:500. If that does happen, I'm sorry but I do think that's very dangerous on such a minimum setting with that capital.

As I said only my opinion and do welcome yours.

   drsong123 posted:
   
Hi, Dustin
Could you please to elaborate some more about what you mean 'Once you exceed 10k there are not any advantages since it scales at every 10k.'
thanks
ss

The smallest trade size available is a micro lot for most firms. For this reason we can not trade any smaller and since RL1 is one micro lot for each 10k of margin you dont gain any advantage from a risk perspective by adding more. Your profit amount will increase but your risk will not improve. An example is a 3k account with a 600 draw down on rl 1 would be a greater percentage draw down than on a 10k account although it would be the same dollar amount because they are both trading 1 micro lot. However once you get above 10k it will add another micro lot to the starting trade which means you can make more money but your risk is not improved because you are doubling your risk. This is why the scale in the members area start around 5k. Does this make sense. Its a simple concept but is somewhat difficult to articulate.

I 'd like to know Dustin's thoughts on closing positions in profit manually - so just tossing this around here- my feeling is best to leave it alone if you have sufficient margin or can keep the equity up by extra deposits ( I did this), reason being it will obviously make it much harder for ea to get out of those early positions. If gbpusd goes back up, well I will be proved wrong of course & it should re-enter those shorts anyway & meantime you would have taken the profit which would be nice. It's a risk either way - short term gain versus long term stuck in early trades or short term gain & poss. to re- enter at the highs again anyway if it retraces back up. There's euro & gbp interest rate thrown in for good measure coming up as well, although forecast is no change anything could happen the way the market is. At best if no change should be ok or even a drop, worst case if they hike the rates we'll be back up there again & those that took profit manually will be happy they did! Euro is holding it's own at the moment which is bad for those still in the big DD there, could still be a downward re-trace coming though. I'm only $134 down overall after 2 gbpusd SL's & overall profit @ $2,011 & I have one more small gu lot of 0.02 then it starts to get painful @ 0.07 lots. Manual trades on a different account with same broker I have so far covered losses & more. Not suggesting to follow my line here, others are quite entitled to their own.

   littlemax posted:
   I 'd like to know Dustin's thoughts on closing positions in profit manually - so just tossing this around here- my feeling is best to leave it alone if you have sufficient margin or can keep the equity up by extra deposits ( I did this), reason being it will obviously make it much harder for ea to get out of those early positions. If gbpusd goes back up, well I will be proved wrong of course & it should re-enter those shorts anyway & meantime you would have taken the profit which would be nice. It's a risk either way - short term gain versus long term stuck in early trades or short term gain & poss. to re- enter at the highs again anyway if it retraces back up. There's euro & gbp interest rate thrown in for good measure coming up as well, although forecast is no change anything could happen the way the market is. At best if no change should be ok or even a drop, worst case if they hike the rates we'll be back up there again & those that took profit manually will be happy they did! Euro is holding it's own at the moment which is bad for those still in the big DD there, could still be a downward re-trace coming though. I'm only $134 down overall after 2 gbpusd SL's & overall profit @ $2,011 & I have one more small gu lot of 0.02 then it starts to get painful @ 0.07 lots. Manual trades on a different account with same broker I have so far covered losses & more. Not suggesting to follow my line here, others are quite entitled to their own.

This depends on your desire to get involved. Its possible that in this case you could over ride but I think at that point you would be committing to trading the account until the draw down was overcome. Meaning until this basket is closed you would probably need to manage it on going or at minimum keep a close eye on it.

Personally I dont have time to try and manage it manually so I just leave it alone but admittedly that's easy to say when I am not in a draw down that concerns me. None the less I do prefer to leave it alone and just let it do its thing. After all that's what we are putting it out there as. A set it and forget it software. If you are leveraged up or in a deep draw down than it may behoove you to intervene. Just be prepeared to stay involved if you choose to do that.

From a technical stand point I do believe that a good trader could manage there way out of this more effectively but for me as long as it gets out without blowing up I am confident that it will make back any losses and for me time is more valuable than the few dollars I may be able to save now by managing it manually. I would prefer to see it take some losses knowing it will recover rather than spending the time and having to worry about what happens when i am asleep all to get what may only be a little bit better overall result. Remember, I am looking at this long term. I know that if I can average even 6% a month my money will double every year. That may not be a lot in the beginning but even with a start up of 3k that is over 1.5 million in 10 years. So for me the little stuff that happens along the way is not a concern. Account survival is though and that is the only time I think I might intervene is if it meant the difference between a margin call etc. So if you are in that situation it may be wise to intervene but it will then come back to your personal abilities. If they you are not a great trader in general than it could be a toss up. You could do more harm than good. Thats why staying on the lower side of the guidelines is so important. Hope that helps.

Thanks for coming here & giving a balanced input there Dustin on subject of intervention, I appreciate it & I'm sure others do as well esp. as you have your own money riding here as well.

   GlobalProfit posted:
  ... We have also said that the guidelines set up are for 400.1 accounts ...

Does this correlate directly as half the margin rate = half the max recommended risk ?

e.g. best practise EA says minimum is $11500 for RL8, if you only have 200:1 would that mean you need$23k (2x) to go to RL8 and a 50:1 would need $92,000 (8x) (faaaaaaaaaaar!!) for RL8 or conversely with $11500 and 200:1 (1/2) you should stick to RL4 or on 50:1 (1/8th) stay at RL1 ?

   GlobalProfit posted:

This depends on your desire to get involved. Its possible that in this case you could over ride but I think at that point you would be committing to trading the account until the draw down was overcome. Meaning until this basket is closed you would probably need to manage it on going or at minimum keep a close eye on it...

...So for me the little stuff that happens along the way is not a concern. Account survival is though and that is the only time I think I might intervene is if it meant the difference between a margin call etc. So if you are in that situation it may be wise to intervene but it will then come back to your personal abilities. If they you are not a great trader in general than it could be a toss up. You could do more harm than good. Thats why staying on the lower side of the guidelines is so important. Hope that helps.

On the matter of account survival vs 'tinkering' rather than letting the EA get on with its job, I thoroughly agree. However, there are times when a 'good' trader can intervene simply and quickly and provide a better outcome. Indeed, one doesn't have to be that good. I'm currently locked into EUR/USD with large DD as my own instance of TEA on this pair fell 5 pips short on the collective basket Profit Take last week when the market reversed. All it did was bounce off support, which was something I'd already spotted as a possible, but I was on a 'plane when the reversal happened. Had I been able to adjust or override the PT (without deactivating the EA), I would have backed the PT off a mere 10 pips, checked in when I landed and found that I was out of what has since become a problematic set of trades.

So, mods to the EA that enable a hybrid of individual control and clever automation would (for me) make an already good EA truly great. I genuinely believe this thing has legs and will stand apart from even many of the decent EAs out there, so why not upgrade its range-trading capacity to something more all-encompassing by enabling some user intervention? Julian and tradingshed have already discussed Trailing Stops on here. I'm asking for basket PT override. With the focus on current DD for most of us, the original discussion on product developments and a wishlist kind of died, but I'm sure other more capable traders than me will have even better suggestions. For now, why not use this to get that ball rolling again?

Looking forward to feedback and input.

Interestingly - some time back I was having HUGE DD when no-one else was, in fact Dustin claimed to be 'flat', now I am having only average DD while everyone else is having huge DD - weird.

I wonder though if that is because for some reason no new trades have been added since 01 FEb on my account......

Hi Dustin,

Thats not what I recall. What sold me is that during one of the webinars, it was said that at least $1000 was recommended but no less than $750. I was sold.

Everything was going fine when I was 50:1 with Alpari. Turned a profit and basically became a cheerleader for this EA. I withdrew from Alpari so I could deposit with a broker that would give me the benefit of hedging. I also switched to mirroring with tradency, but then a big drawdown was looming.

Trying not to panic I contacted Tom since you guys were busy with recovering the site, and Tom (who seems like a really nice guy) eventually suggested that I close out my biggest 2 to 3 trades or Add more money. I was real disappointed, because the whole real I bought the EA was for *it* to do the trading for me, since I relatively new. I know I know... I understood the risks, but I also thought I understood this to be mostly 'hands off', since putting your emotional, inexperienced hands on it could kill things.

Before I got a chance to make a choice on what to do (in a matter of hours), I got a margin call and the lost half the account.

So, I disconnected from Tradency, and started using the Ea these guys are using mt4i.com/users/illuminati
Deposit: $50,000 on 2012/01/05 23:27:49
Currently: Bal. $84,414.00 and -$445.00 in open trades (thats less than 1% of the balance)
Gain:+62.32%
Abs. Gain:+62.43%
Daily: 1.43%
Monthly: 51.48%
Drawdown: 13.91%

So our little test account is making a comeback since the EA is meant to work with as little as $100
mt4i.com/users/foreigncurrency

I would love to return to Toms EA, and Tom said that the EA can recover the account, but...

I'm not trying to put you on the spot, or in a bad light, but my questions are:
- What changed between version 1.44 (when I was a beta tester) to now (ver. 1.89)?
- Why wasn't it specifically stated at forex traders daily that if you had under a certain amount, manual intervention would be required (I search and search before I got stopped out)
- Why weren't we (I) notified if the trading requirements changed?

Humbly,
Pete

P.S. Im actually a few studying a few trading courses now

   GlobalProfit posted:
...For anyone that has experienced a margin call it is my guess that you were trading a smaller account. From the beginning we have told people that you could trade this EA with as little as 1k if you had 400.1 but it was not recommended. The more money you have up to a point any way the less risk you take.

   foreigncurrency posted:
   Hi Dustin,

Thats not what I recall. What sold me is that during one of the webinars, it was said that at least $1000 was recommended but no less than $750. I was sold.

Everything was going fine when I was 50:1 with Alpari. Turned a profit and basically became a cheerleader for this EA. I withdrew from Alpari so I could deposit with a broker that would give me the benefit of hedging. I also switched to mirroring with tradency, but then a big drawdown was looming.

Trying not to panic I contacted Tom since you guys were busy with recovering the site, and Tom (who seems like a really nice guy) eventually suggested that I close out my biggest 2 to 3 trades or Add more money. I was real disappointed, because the whole real I bought the EA was for *it* to do the trading for me, since I relatively new. I know I know... I understood the risks, but I also thought I understood this to be mostly 'hands off', since putting your emotional, inexperienced hands on it could kill things.

Before I got a chance to make a choice on what to do (in a matter of hours), I got a margin call and the lost half the account.

So, I disconnected from Tradency, and started using the Ea these guys are using mt4i.com/users/illuminati
Deposit: $50,000 on 2012/01/05 23:27:49
Currently: Bal. $84,414.00 and -$445.00 in open trades (thats less than 1% of the balance)
Gain:+62.32%
Abs. Gain:+62.43%
Daily: 1.43%
Monthly: 51.48%
Drawdown: 13.91%

So our little test account is making a comeback since the EA is meant to work with as little as $100
mt4i.com/users/foreigncurrency

I would love to return to Toms EA, and Tom said that the EA can recover the account, but...

I'm not trying to put you on the spot, or in a bad light, but my questions are:
- What changed between version 1.44 (when I was a beta tester) to now (ver. 1.89)?
- Why wasn't it specifically stated at forex traders daily that if you had under a certain amount, manual intervention would be required (I search and search before I got stopped out)
- Why weren't we (I) notified if the trading requirements changed?

Humbly,
Pete

P.S. Im actually a few studying a few trading courses now

   GlobalProfit posted:
...For anyone that has experienced a margin call it is my guess that you were trading a smaller account. From the beginning we have told people that you could trade this EA with as little as 1k if you had 400.1 but it was not recommended. The more money you have up to a point any way the less risk you take.

Happy to see I wasn't the only one who remembers the sell pitch in the webinar, thought I was dreaming it in the end!

Hi
On Dustins WPFX live account they started with $10000 and used RL8. Now there are a balace of $27500 and they use RL6, they have used RL6 since beginning of december. So the recommendation to use RL8 with account >$11500, they only use RL6 for $27500.