Is forex gambling?

It is not gambling,

if you
A. know what you are doing
B. are not greedy
C. have a patience
D. remove emotions from trading
E. stick to a good plan

It took my years to stop loosing money on forex and start profiting 10% /mo
It was tough but it is possible

togr posted:
It is not gambling,

if you
A. know what you are doing
B. are not greedy
C. have a patience
D. remove emotions from trading
E. stick to a good plan

It took my years to stop loosing money on forex and start profiting 10% /mo
It was tough but it is possible

Yes, that its.
Mutch discipline and a good plan in combination with a perfect moneymanagement.
Joe

It is still gambling in the eyes of the goatherders that invented two major religions in the middle east about 1400-2000 years ago.
If you are worried about what your God/Allah will think about this, you probably shouldn't be here. It is sinful and wrong.


Can we not let this fracking thread die now?

Ironman posted:
It is still gambling in the eyes of the goatherders that invented two major religions in the middle east about 1400-2000 years ago.
If you are worried about what your God/Allah will think about this, you probably shouldn't be here. It is sinful and wrong.


Can we not let this fracking thread die now?

BTW I think these guys are actually the best traders - both real life and forex;)

togr posted:

BTW I think these guys are actually the best traders - both real life and forex;)

If what you say is true, maybe it has something to do with having four wives ;)

No one beats the bank we just beat each other up! 😇

forexalertsystem posted:
No one beats the bank we just beat each other up! 😇

I disagree with the 'no one' wording.

There are constantly profitable private traders. The fact that they don't advertise themselves on MyFxBook does not mean that they don't exist.

Did not say you can't be profitable just saying no one beats the banks. your forgetting that on the end of every winning trade is a loser. chances are its an unskilled trader on that other end... banks win period with the spread they charge you from the start....

this recent article is a good example of how the game is rigged.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-01-16/metals-currency-rigging-worse-than-libor-bafin-s-koenig-says.html

Well, it is a definite advantage to be a 'wholesaler' (bank) on a market where there are plenty of retail shops (brokers) and customers (traders). The service provided by banks on the Forex market is a service similar to one casinos provide to gamblers.

I agree that banks (as casinos) cannot be beaten, but who wants to beat the banks (casinos)...?

FxMasterGuru posted:
Well, it is a definite advantage to be a 'wholesaler' (bank) on a market where there are plenty of retail shops (brokers) and customers (traders). The service provided by banks on the Forex market is a service similar to one casinos provide to gamblers.

I agree that banks (as casinos) cannot be beaten, but who wants to beat the banks (casinos)...?

Well said; my last words on this, Forex is not a competition; between traders and banks or traders and brokers or traders and other traders.
It's a constant moving market of money, that's all. If a trader is smart, they simply follow the fundamentals and not just the indicators and they can grab some of it. Manage it and they can keep some of it...Follow the money...save the money.

No it's not. It's gambling if you don't know what you are doing. Profitable traders are sought after because they are able to make a better probability of predicting the market trends. If they can have more winning predictions that means they know where the money is at.

It looks like gambling because its too fast and there are no boundaries at all which makes risk the same all throughout and the deals and contracts are executed very fast, its the same with other investments except the losses and wins are realized quicker depending on your trading strategy. There is no investment without any form of risk.

For me pure gambling is binary options, since from the looks of it you don't take into account other pertinent data.

To put it simply money rewards the hard workers so if a country has good fundamentals then its currency will definitely improve.

lastpiponearth posted:
No it's not. It's gambling if you don't know what you are doing. Profitable traders are sought after because they are able to make a better probability of predicting the market trends. If they can have more winning predictions that means they know where the money is at.

It looks like gambling because its too fast and there are no boundaries at all which makes risk the same all throughout and the deals and contracts are executed very fast, its the same with other investments except the losses and wins are realized quicker depending on your trading strategy. There is no investment without any form of risk.

For me pure gambling is binary options, since from the looks of it you don't take into account other pertinent data.

To put it simply money rewards the hard workers so if a country has good fundamentals then its currency will definitely improve.

Well said! Totally agree.

forexpipcatcha posted:

NewMillenniumInc posted:
Hi Folks,

This topic caught my eye and as Ive been trading and building forex systems for the past ten years for both private and retail applications, and suffered through the learning experience like everyone else has who's gotten this far, I thought my opinion would be appreciated on this thread.

Is forex a gamble ? For most people it is if by the definition of 'gamblers' you mean losers and I use the analogy of a Casino to explain.

'Most folks' walk through the doors with stars in their eyes and dreams of taking the house to the cleaners. But, as we all know Casinos are built on a house of losers and its usually the house taking the gambler to the cleaners.

However, there do exist card counters, they take a mental note of the cards laid out on the table and use their mind to mathematically determine the odds of certain outcomes and bet accordingly. Over time, the benefit of this consistent 'edge' plays out into their favour. They are not 'most folks'.

How it applies in forex trading is exactly the same.

Traders (gamblers with a forex trading habit) need to consistently apply a profitable edge and one that is sufficiently profitable enough to overcome the inefficiencies involved in the FX market, including but not limited to spread and slippage, which eat into the expectancy of a profitable trading edge.

Most folks don't trade with a profitable edge and even when they do, they either don't realize it and discard it on a losing run or can't apply it consistently enough to realize the longer term benefits.

The question that arises next is obvious, what defines a profitable trading edge ? It is one of the single most important questions you should be asking yourself (if you haven't already) and I can but tender my definition as the minimum required standards;

1) greater than 10:1 return to drawdown ratio over a minimum 10 year to date backtest period using fixed lots per trade (which will be problematic/not applicable with systems that use variable pips SL and too much to go into detail about here)
2) tests conducted with realistic spread and volume commiss
3) tests using appropriate data modelling type, ie ticks for tick system bar open for bar open system, bar open systems run on ticks showing very nearly same result as bar open data.
4) minimum 1000 trades sample.
5) minimum 2 pips expectancy and ideally above 3 (net expected profit per trade factoring all winning and losing trades)
6) no martingale grids (although I dont completely rule out such system if designed with equity stop loss which can be hit repeated and recover from over extended period, which I only know of one system)
7) must work on minimum 6 currency pairs meeting all the above mentioned minimum standards
8) must have live fwd history not exceeding previous maximum drawdown or stagnation period (period between new equity highs), which if exceeded the system can be said to have failed.

That's what determines a profitable trading edge to me and I haven't yet seen a system built to these minimum standards fail by measure of the definition above mentioned. I can also say that I don't often encounter systems that meet these minimum standards either, I know of less than 5 after 10 years in FX and yet that is what 'most folks' seek to make profit with when trading FX. Most (but not all) good systems just never reach retail traders because systems can then be copied, stolen by hackers, distributed and/or otherwise abused.

I favour automated algorithms because at least technology can be consistently applied. The human mode with discretion is prone to failure if for no other reason than lack of consistency. And let's face it, if a system is truly profitable then it can be programmed into an algorithm and shouldn't need human intervention. If a system does not even stand up in a backtest, think about the disadvantage that puts you at out of the box ! Good luck with that because that's what you'll be needing. That's not to be confused with my opinion that an experienced trader can successfully intervene using judgement and improve a systems profitability, but its complimentary - not the difference between profitability and loss stand alone.

Thats my 2 pips worth and I trust it helps you make more informed decisions in FX than 'most folks' do.

Cheers :)

Adam Liddiard
Trading Director
New Millennium Inc

Care to show us some results to provide us more clear picture and back up what you say. At least 3 years worth of goodies.

Hi,

Well, Im glad you asked. You might need to wait another 2 years if you want 3 years of live fwd, but I have 10 years in FX and only recently (past 12 months or so) have we (my team and I) discovered what it really takes to build a profitable system, which we've applied to 4 subsequent system which so far have performed as expected, excluding issues encountered with a bug (we have discovered and are fixing) on one system that is not a part of the intended design.

We've cracked the formula to create profitable EA systems, everything we have done confirms this and like I say no system designed the way we do has failed yet, ie the system have performed within previous historical parameters, win loose or draw in the short term.

Every system has long bar open backtest on multiple pairs with good ROI:DD and expectancy, meeting the specs I previously outlined.

1) NMI SuperClimber doing stellar, and just like in backtesting.

https://www.myfxbook.com/strategies/nmi-super-climber-1-lot/50247
https://www.myfxbook.com/members/NewMillenniumInc/nmi-superclimber-25/745832

Trading at 18% risk I could show you an account that generated nearly 700% with this system and on a decent sized account, but out of respect for the privacy of the client we don't.

2) NMI Carnivore also doing stellar, and just like in backtesting

https://auth.new-millenniuminc.com/gate/backtests/portfolio/cv_portfolio.htm
https://www.myfxbook.com/members/NewMillenniumInc/nmi-carnivore/790894

3) NMI Extrapolous doing stellar, and just like in backtesting

https://auth.new-millenniuminc.com/gate/backtests/portfolio/ex_portfolio.htm
https://www.myfxbook.com/members/NewMillenniumInc/nmi-extrapolus/783465

4) NMI Firefly NOT, but its a big that makes it trade different only tick versus bar open backtest, but its technical issue not a failing of the system and one that we're in the process of sorting, after which we dont expect too much deviation.

https://auth.new-millenniuminc.com/gate/backtests/portfolio/ff_portfolio.htm
https://www.myfxbook.com/members/NewMillenniumInc/nmi-firefly-demo/776605

5) We've another completely private system that has never been released which is only traded privately on 1 x MAM that is so far our second most successful system after the Super Climber, it has numbers and specs that surpass all but the Super Climber.

I know that no one else in the FX industry has a working portfolio including so many quality systems headed up by as many developers AND we have another with solid 3 month live history also using similar design philosophies. Its not an in house design but one of a partner to NMI. Yet to slot it into the Expertgate for a retail release but I have the backtest in hand and its from our old friend Momods ; https://www.myfxbook.com/members/momods/mps/730424

You can bet our next design will be better again......its just about become easy, dare I say it, or rather its become a process rather than a journey into the unknown like it is for most system developers.

So, to reiterate - FX trading with a proven statistically validated edges is not gambling. Everyone can have their opinion but until they can back up their opinions with the level of proof that I can and do, then I dont put much weight in other peoples opinions....It all about facts, what you can prove and what you have achieved, the rest is just noise.

I read something funny years back that sticks in my mind - opinions are like assholes - everyone has one !

Yeap, Im giving my company and its team and our products a promo here - but if anyone has sensible questions and insights or feedback to post here in this thread to me, I'll take the time to reply and provide you my experienced and qualified insights so long as I feel they are valued and respected.

Cheers, Adam :)

Hello,
I am new to EPXTRADING and I am wondering how good is this company?

efata_investasi posted:
Is trading Forex gamble? because so many people often told me that forex is gambling, so there is more loser than a winner on forex business

If you think forex is gambling because of people told you and more loser than a winner so it's not fair.

People often told you that forex is gambling is no evidence.
More loser than a winner because trader trade without risk control, trade with no money managed.

If forex doesn't offer leverage, we would hard to see losers any more :)

 

My take. FX is or isn't gambling dependant only on your approach to it.

I do think 99% of people are far too prone to making trading decisions based on fear or greed and that is gambling.

Decisions made in a bricks and mortar business based on emotions are equally disastrous and result in their failure as well. Just like in FX, businesses that have a written plan keep carefully maintained records and use the data to monitor and improve their performance are not gambling, they are trading and usually prospering.

Those using EAs I liken to people who buy a franchise. If researched properly and managed appropriately these can be very profitable and again in no way gambling. If however you are the type who hears of the latest greatest and has to get in on it so you don't miss out you are exactly the same as a gambler with a tip on a horse and you are gambling.

It is what you make it and it is one of the hardest professions on earth to master. It's also one of the easiest ways to gamble away everything.

The choice is yours. Gamble or Trade.

Thats my 2 pips worth and I trust it helps you make more informed decisions in FX than 'most folks' do.

Well, your -2.7 Pip 😇

Expectancy: -2.7 Pips

Source:

https://www.myfxbook.com/members/NewMillenniumInc/nmi-extrapolus-new/811956

systems can then be copied, stolen by hackers, distributed and/or otherwise abused.

Really? Yours too? 😑😐😲😳😞😕

Nemesis of all automated systems 😉

why post pictures of yourself while trying to make trading decision