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OutsideTheBoxHK posted:

Q_FxTrader posted:
It is usually difficult to find reliable signal providers to continue with them in long term. Same is true to become a long term signal provider as well.

Because for someone to become a popular signal provider, he has to make very high % consistent daily return, otherwise, no one will even look into the signals. In order to do that obviously the signal provider has to take high risk in his account.

Next, once it becomes a little popular and number of subscribers become more, it becomes the target of big players like brokers or funds who can just manipulate the market price a couple of times so that the account will be wiped out and signal will collapse.

Many of the subscribers who have been following signals here will agree with me for most of the signals. Only those signals which makes a very low % return may continue for long time, but again the signal provider may not find much subscribers and he might be profitable even more by offering MAM.

In my perspective, the best practice is to start taking control of the signals and it's followers amounts etc once it becomes popular to fully monitor the trades and it's activity so that the trades or trading system will not be misused or manipulated by big players.

Though I was not sure whether to provide signals or offer MAM service, finally I have decided to start as a signal provider first in high risk mode and then, proceed from there. My signals might be available within next few days or weeks.

I have already ventured on this path that you have described above -- over the past 25 months. And I have done all the things you are talking about.
I do not wholly agreed though about brokers/funds targeting a signal once it becomes popular. No intervention or manipulation on their part can have anything to do with open trades of a signal provider. these are straw man arguments. common excuses for poor performance.
Have a look at my systems and you will find what consistency and resilience are all about on this 'risky journey'.

I have to agree that so far you have maintained a overall good trading profile.

However, I am referring here about high risk traders who target high monthly % return like 100%,200% per month and not about low risk traders targeting 5% to 20% per month.

Obviously, it is very difficult to affect the trades of a low risk trader by any large entity or corporation as well, because in order to do that the market has to move hundreds of pips in one side which is usually impossible except for technical glitch or flash crash events etc.

But for a high risk trader where his margin call or max DD is 20 to 40 pips away and who is trading millions of USD using high leverage can be easily affected by a big player and a regular broker or hedge fund can easily do that for sure.

shotputty posted:

Q_FxTrader posted:
Because for someone to become a popular signal provider, he has to make very high % consistent daily return, otherwise, no one will even look into the signals. In order to do that obviously the signal provider has to take high risk in his account.

Next, once it becomes a little popular and number of subscribers become more, it becomes the target of big players like brokers or funds who can just manipulate the market price a couple of times so that the account will be wiped out and signal will collapse.

In my short history I can confirm this for a few signals already. When I join a signal it has not so many followers, then after a few weeks there are hundreds of followers. Then it busts. History repeating.

The ugly truth is you have to figure it out yourself and let nobody join your strategy :-p

It seems to me like you chose the wrong signals to follow, truly.
The best signals are NOT the ones which attract most subscribers, because the 'herd' wants quick gains, high risk and a quick get-rich plan, and it doesn't work like this.
Want a signal which won't get wiped out fast? I advise looking up for my rules of signal searching and following them.
And if you're in doubt, pick signals of accounts which are at least 1 year old.

shotputty posted:

Q_FxTrader posted:
Because for someone to become a popular signal provider, he has to make very high % consistent daily return, otherwise, no one will even look into the signals. In order to do that obviously the signal provider has to take high risk in his account.

Next, once it becomes a little popular and number of subscribers become more, it becomes the target of big players like brokers or funds who can just manipulate the market price a couple of times so that the account will be wiped out and signal will collapse.

In my short history I can confirm this for a few signals already. When I join a signal it has not so many followers, then after a few weeks there are hundreds of followers. Then it busts. History repeating.

The ugly truth is you have to figure it out yourself and let nobody join your strategy :-p

true.

Unfortunately, that is the reality of the forex trading and signal service.

But actually it is not always the number of subscribers which make the algo fail, rather it is the volume of money which make the algo fail.

Also, usually the 100% winning systems busts easily, because the signal providers don't want to loose their track record of trading by closing in loss and ultimately wipe out the balance. That is exactly what the big players take the advantage and manipulate the price for a couple of times and all money gone.

shotputty posted:

Q_FxTrader posted:
Because for someone to become a popular signal provider, he has to make very high % consistent daily return, otherwise, no one will even look into the signals. In order to do that obviously the signal provider has to take high risk in his account.

Next, once it becomes a little popular and number of subscribers become more, it becomes the target of big players like brokers or funds who can just manipulate the market price a couple of times so that the account will be wiped out and signal will collapse.

In my short history I can confirm this for a few signals already. When I join a signal it has not so many followers, then after a few weeks there are hundreds of followers. Then it busts. History repeating.

The ugly truth is you have to figure it out yourself and let nobody join your strategy :-p

this is entirely due to what traders and system analysts call 'capacity' or 'divergence'.
The more simultaneous funds that are being executed with one system, that system must not have high divergence. otherwise it's 'capacity' will destroy any profits gained.
Darwinex explains this in their 'Investable Attributes' of 'capacity'. See DARWIN BUX, BUC, and XUX to understand these performance metrics.

Q_FxTrader posted:
It is usually difficult to find reliable signal providers to continue with them in long term. Same is true to become a long term signal provider as well.

Because for someone to become a popular signal provider, he has to make very high % consistent daily return, otherwise, no one will even look into the signals. In order to do that obviously the signal provider has to take high risk in his account.

Next, once it becomes a little popular and number of subscribers become more, it becomes the target of big players like brokers or funds who can just manipulate the market price a couple of times so that the account will be wiped out and signal will collapse.

Many of the subscribers who have been following signals here will agree with me for most of the signals. Only those signals which makes a very low % return may continue for long time, but again the signal provider may not find much subscribers and he might be profitable even more by offering MAM.

In my perspective, the best practice is to start taking control of the signals and it's followers amounts etc once it becomes popular to fully monitor the trades and it's activity so that the trades or trading system will not be misused or manipulated by big players.

Though I was not sure whether to provide signals or offer MAM service, finally I have decided to start as a signal provider first in high risk mode and then, proceed from there. My signals might be available within next few days or weeks.

I have already ventured on this path that you have described above -- over the past 25 months. And I have done all the things you are talking about.
I do not wholly agreed though about brokers/funds targeting a signal once it becomes popular. No intervention or manipulation on their part can have anything to do with open trades of a signal provider. these are straw man arguments. common excuses for poor performance.

Q_FxTrader posted:
Because for someone to become a popular signal provider, he has to make very high % consistent daily return, otherwise, no one will even look into the signals. In order to do that obviously the signal provider has to take high risk in his account.

Next, once it becomes a little popular and number of subscribers become more, it becomes the target of big players like brokers or funds who can just manipulate the market price a couple of times so that the account will be wiped out and signal will collapse.

In my short history I can confirm this for a few signals already. When I join a signal it has not so many followers, then after a few weeks there are hundreds of followers. Then it busts. History repeating.

The ugly truth is you have to figure it out yourself and let nobody join your strategy :-p

It is usually difficult to find reliable signal providers to continue with them in long term. Same is true to become a long term signal provider as well.

Because for someone to become a popular signal provider, he has to make very high % consistent daily return, otherwise, no one will even look into the signals. In order to do that obviously the signal provider has to take high risk in his account.

Next, once it becomes a little popular and number of subscribers become more, it becomes the target of big players like brokers or funds who can just manipulate the market price a couple of times so that the account will be wiped out and signal will collapse.

Many of the subscribers who have been following signals here will agree with me for most of the signals. Only those signals which makes a very low % return may continue for long time, but again the signal provider may not find much subscribers and he might be profitable even more by offering MAM.

In my perspective, the best practice is to start taking control of the signals and it's followers amounts etc once it becomes popular to fully monitor the trades and it's activity so that the trades or trading system will not be misused or manipulated by big players.

Though I was not sure whether to provide signals or offer MAM service, finally I have decided to start as a signal provider first in high risk mode and then, proceed from there. My signals might be available within next few days or weeks.

There are several good providers, thanks!

Q_FxTrader posted:
Signal start seems to be a good option for both beginner traders and experienced traders to mutually benefit each other under specific scenarios, but not always.

If a signal provider will continue to provide very good signals with high percentage returns, then there is always a risk of misuse of trades to get duplicated by one of the followers to copy trades to multiple mt4 accounts.

Also, signal start has certain payment limitations which are not favourable for signal providers. For example, the signal price can be maximum 500 USD which is not good for a signal provider, because everyone will be charged the same price whether someone is having few hundred dollar balance or few thousand or million USD balance.

So most of the high % return signals usually don't last long. Either the accounts get wiped out now or later or the signal provider simply moves to better options like MAM/PAMM services.

Another payment limitation is that it has a maximum limit of 5000 USD withdrawal per day which is not suitable for signal providers with large number of subscribers.

My opinions might be biased a little because I am a signal provider, but what information I mentioned above are simple facts.

Very good insight on the inner workings.

I know for me, making a $5000 withdrawal daily would be amazing. Currently I fit into the other category of investors with a smaller balance. Its unfortunate that via signalstart that we're unable to connect directly with our signal provider. I'd gladly compensate my provider for good returns or lengthy service.

If there are signal providers out there with stable, sizable returns, Id be more than willing to explore any options.

@stimblo , great tips!

I would also like to emphasize the importance of deposits and withdrawals issue:
When you see that an account made 13,000% percent already, but he has only $100 in his account, and deposited $100,000 and withdrew $999,900, that should give you a red flag.
I am over-exaggerating on purpose, but you really should not pay attention only to the percentage, as many really do.

Having said that, I want to state my set of rules, hoping it will help you or you could sympathize with it and remark on it:

1. Look carefully at the amount in the account. If it is less than what you're willing to put, don't go for it.

2. Look how many months the account has lost in the past 12 months. If it is a number you cannot cope with, don't go there (it doesn't have to be 0 losing months, but for me more than 3 losing months per year, no matter the amount, is just the statistical and psycological red line).

3. Profit factor - a major issue to look at, for signal seekers. Because of slippages and other technicalities, our account will not perform exactly as the signal account, so we want to make sure, no matter the risk we set, that at least we will have enough margin of error and still be profitable.
So my profit factor suggestion is to look for 2.0 and above, not less than that. Ever.

4. Check the monthly bar graph. Estimate how much money (or percentage) you would make each month on your own money, and deduct the monthly signal subscription from it. Verify that is a number you are satisfied with.

5. Use the advanced search criteria. My search criteria are: REAL accounts, which are around for at least 6 months, with drawdown below 50%. Then I go over the list, sorted by percentage, but I disregard immediately every account which doesn't hold my 1-4 rules.
Number of pips does not matter, price does not matter and number of trades do not matter.

Conclusion:
I was reading some of the previous posts here and was really sorry to hear that people lost money using the signals there.
Following the above set of rules and sticking with the same signal for at least a quarter of a year without canceling or moving away and trying something new, should give you ease of mind and satisfaction.
You may even subscribe to several signals at a time, as long as you keep each signal attached with a different account, and don't deviate from the rules.
Don't let large numbers, great looking graphs and on-the-spot decisions to fool you!


Best of luck!


Full Disclosure: I am a signal provider in Signal Start. My set of rules is used to locate my own, but also others who perform better than me, to invest with them and diverge my portfolio.

Signal start seems to be a good option for both beginner traders and experienced traders to mutually benefit each other under specific scenarios, but not always.

If a signal provider will continue to provide very good signals with high percentage returns, then there is always a risk of misuse of trades to get duplicated by one of the followers to copy trades to multiple mt4 accounts.

Also, signal start has certain payment limitations which are not favourable for signal providers. For example, the signal price can be maximum 500 USD which is not good for a signal provider, because everyone will be charged the same price whether someone is having few hundred dollar balance or few thousand or million USD balance.

So most of the high % return signals usually don't last long. Either the accounts get wiped out now or later or the signal provider simply moves to better options like MAM/PAMM services.

Another payment limitation is that it has a maximum limit of 5000 USD withdrawal per day which is not suitable for signal providers with large number of subscribers.

My opinions might be biased a little because I am a signal provider, but what information I mentioned above are simple facts.

Hi fellow investor in Signal Start.
I have been following Signal start for about 2 years now and have seen signals come and go. I have probably lost more than I have won, but now growing my account slowly.

I would like to share some tips I have learned.

1) very rarely multiply and if you do not over 3. (Seriously it may seem like a good idea to multiply; a drawdown of 6 means even if I multiply it to 10 it won’t bust and I will make so much money)
The drawdowns are constantly tested and broken. Don’t forget slippage which usually makes the investor slippage awful. To be honest now I usually multiple by .5 so reduce risk so a blown account by trader still keeps me in the game.

2) focus on saving the money vs. making money. Seriously loosing money is far too easy. Select extremely carefully. Good criteria is not just how long the signal has been around and amount person has invested themselves. Look at the date the signal became available on Signal Start and see how it has performed ever since then. Give it at least a month on Signal start before investing. Also look at the average trade time remember you cannot copy shorter trades. Also look at history, see how often the trader makes deposits and withdrawals, unless they are a PAMM of course.

I have sent them about 6 questions on different occasions, only one of them was not answered because I replied the question was already solved before they could answer. Every other question I had was answered on the same day. I bet they get a lot of questions...

Recently signed up for 'Diamond' as I thought it would be best for my account.

I sent an email Monday night trying to get some information before I signed up. I got a reply this morning after I had already signed up. I sent another email asking a couple questions I couldn't find answers to yesterday afternoon and have not got a reply as of yet.

I would be interested to see how many actual paying customers they have that makes them unable to reply to an email in a timely manner. Also, being able to know a bit more about your signal provider would be beneficial. I can see when they have had multiple signals come out, but other than that, no info. Even a message system within the website would work.

Starting with the good. The connection with the account is very reliable, that's a big plus. There is a constant addition of signal providers, which is also good. Some signal providers are very good, and I would consider SignalStart one of the best places available to find these. Now to the bad stuff. The platform is way too old tech. Parameter options are quite poor compared to some competing platforms. There are outages when needing to change parameters, especially on weekends. For some reason, the related signal providers are not displayed in the table format of the follower's account analysis, even though there are some time consuming manual workaround to this. Customer support does reply within 24hr, but c'mon email only? Like with many other platforms, some signal providers are either utter crap or simply risk-nut-crazy to a point if the staff did a bit more homework they would dismiss some of them systematically even for the more risk-hungry followers. Having said all that, this is my favorite platform and I will continue using it. I hope the company will apply some of the much needed improvements without raising the cost to the subscribers. I believe this platform is still considered 'affordable' when you consider its potential, but if cost rises I believe they will see their customer base diminish quickly.

I've read almost this entire topic. Although it is full of positive review-spam, which is pretty much ridiculous, I did subscribe for a signal, one way below in de rankings, not too fantastic results and one with moderate risk, always 0.1 lot size. I manually check each signals trading history and check ther lot sizes. Some show goof performance while trading 0.1 lots but some occasionally go up as high as 50 lots so they are obiously revenge traging or doing some kind of Martingale.

There is a lot to be improved on the site as far as the filtering goes and ways to communicate with a signal provider. It has massive potential!

Been providing a signal for a couple months now. Connection is really good. Only a couple things I would change:
1. Way to communicate with clients.
2. Rating system explanation (I'm ranked pretty low for what i feel are pretty good stats compared to some I've seen)
3. Sometime in the past, support took a bit longer than i would have liked.

Otherwise great platform! Keep it up!

Good For Newbe

Muy Interesante el sistema. estoy siguiendo unas señales ganadoras hasta ahora. Muchas gracias. Sigan mejorando.