Berndale Capital Securities

ASIC cancels retail OTC derivative issuer Berndale Capital Securities licence and bans former director.
https://asic.gov.au/about-asic/news-centre/find-a-media-release/2018-releases/18-363mr-asic-cancels-retail-otc-derivative-issuer-berndale-capital-securities-licence-and-bans-former-director/

Can anyone advise on how to get one's money back from this broker? Their website has gone (404-Not Found), the don't reply to emails or answer the phone.

hillderek posted:
Can anyone advise on how to get one's money back from this broker? Their website has gone (404-Not Found), the don't reply to emails or answer the phone.

Open new threads in all of the popular forum especially on FPA with the details. Maybe it can help.

hillderek posted:
Can anyone advise on how to get one's money back from this broker? Their website has gone (404-Not Found), the don't reply to emails or answer the phone.

Consider how many people got their money back when Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities defrauded their customers for somewhere between $20 billion and $65 billion (reports vary on final value of fraud claims). Overall around $11 billion was recovered via various means has been distributed to a portion of their investors, however most of their investors will never see their funds again.

Contact the regulatory agency for the country in question and get an attorney.

Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone.

Professional4X posted:

hillderek posted:
Can anyone advise on how to get one's money back from this broker? Their website has gone (404-Not Found), the don't reply to emails or answer the phone.

Consider how many people got their money back when Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities defrauded their customers for somewhere between $20 billion and $65 billion (reports vary on final value of fraud claims). Overall around $11 billion was recovered via various means has been distributed to a portion of their investors, however most of their investors will never see their funds again.

Contact the regulatory agency for the country in question and get an attorney.

Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone.

Not true.........ASIC requires that client funds are kept in segregated accounts. Clients that had funds deposited should contact ASIC: https://asic.gov.au/ and the Australian Financial Complaints Authority: https://www.afca.org.au/

hillderek posted:
Can anyone advise on how to get one's money back from this broker? Their website has gone (404-Not Found), the don't reply to emails or answer the phone.

Professional4X posted:
Consider how many people got their money back when Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities defrauded their customers for somewhere between $20 billion and $65 billion (reports vary on final value of fraud claims). Overall around $11 billion was recovered via various means has been distributed to a portion of their investors, however most of their investors will never see their funds again.

Contact the regulatory agency for the country in question and get an attorney.

Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone.

jonpearce posted:
Not true.........ASIC requires that client funds are kept in segregated accounts. Clients that had funds deposited should contact ASIC: https://asic.gov.au/ and the Australian Financial Complaints Authority: https://www.afca.org.au/

How is what I said NOT TRUE?

That is ABSOLUTELY what they should do.

As I clearly stated above, they should be contact the regulatory and governing bodies, in addition, the OP needs to contact an attorney immediately.

NOTHING I said was untrue.

As per the notice on the government website.

Following an administrative hearing, ASIC found that Berndale:

failed to take reasonable steps to ensure that its representative complied with financial services laws;
failed to have adequate financial and human resources;
failed to maintain an appropriate internal dispute resolution system;
failed to provide financial services efficiently, honestly and fairly;
failed to comply with the client money reporting requirements;
failed to lodge annual financial statements, and audit reports; and
is likely to contravene its general obligations as an AFS licensee.

ASIC also found Mr D’Amore:

was involved in contraventions of financial services laws by Berndale;
is not adequately trained, or is not competent, to provide financial services; and
is likely to contravene a financial services law.

As for what I said about the clients that got funds stolen by Madoff, that too is absolutely correct.
Madoff still owes BILLIONS of dollars to the people he ripped off.


As for actually recovering any funds that a specific client lost due to being defrauded by the now closed brokerage.
The license was pulled and they were shut down because they mishandled the funds and didn't have adequate financials resources available. The most likely scenario is that the funds are gone and the client will probably be out the investment capital.

Professional4X posted:

hillderek posted:
Can anyone advise on how to get one's money back from this broker? Their website has gone (404-Not Found), the don't reply to emails or answer the phone.

Professional4X posted:
Consider how many people got their money back when Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities defrauded their customers for somewhere between $20 billion and $65 billion (reports vary on final value of fraud claims). Overall around $11 billion was recovered via various means has been distributed to a portion of their investors, however most of their investors will never see their funds again.

Contact the regulatory agency for the country in question and get an attorney.

Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone.

jonpearce posted:
Not true.........ASIC requires that client funds are kept in segregated accounts. Clients that had funds deposited should contact ASIC: https://asic.gov.au/ and the Australian Financial Complaints Authority: https://www.afca.org.au/

How is what I said NOT TRUE?

That is ABSOLUTELY what they should do.

As I clearly stated above, they should be contact the regulatory and governing bodies, in addition, the OP needs to contact an attorney immediately.

NOTHING I said was untrue.

As per the notice on the government website.

Following an administrative hearing, ASIC found that Berndale:

failed to take reasonable steps to ensure that its representative complied with financial services laws;
failed to have adequate financial and human resources;
failed to maintain an appropriate internal dispute resolution system;
failed to provide financial services efficiently, honestly and fairly;
failed to comply with the client money reporting requirements;
failed to lodge annual financial statements, and audit reports; and
is likely to contravene its general obligations as an AFS licensee.

ASIC also found Mr D’Amore:

was involved in contraventions of financial services laws by Berndale;
is not adequately trained, or is not competent, to provide financial services; and
is likely to contravene a financial services law.

As for what I said about the clients that got funds stolen by Madoff, that too is absolutely correct.
Madoff still owes BILLIONS of dollars to the people he ripped off.


As for actually recovering any funds that a specific client lost due to being defrauded by the now closed brokerage.
The license was pulled and they were shut down because they mishandled the funds and didn't have adequate financials resources available. The most likely scenario is that the funds are gone and the client will probably be out the investment capital.

I was referring to this statement you made: "Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone."

This is incorrect. Client funds are kept in segregated accounts and unless someone has absconded with the funds they will still be there. Berndale did not go broke, their licence was revoked.

I was referring to this statement you made: "Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone."

This is incorrect. Client funds are kept in segregated accounts and unless someone has absconded with the funds they will still be there. Berndale did not go broke, their licence was revoked.

They lost their license because they didn't have the financial ability to properly handle their clients needs.

The didn't properly protect their clients money. Thus, good luck getting any money back from them.

Professional4X posted:

I was referring to this statement you made: "Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone."

This is incorrect. Client funds are kept in segregated accounts and unless someone has absconded with the funds they will still be there. Berndale did not go broke, their licence was revoked.

They lost their license because they didn't have the financial ability to properly handle their clients needs.

The didn't properly protect their clients money. Thus, good luck getting any money back from them.

Where does it say they fraudulently dealt with clients funds? There would have been criminal charges laid if that was the case. You are scaremongering and certainly not making clients that had money deposited feel any better. We deal with ASIC here not SEC.

jonpearce posted:
I was referring to this statement you made: "Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone."

This is incorrect. Client funds are kept in segregated accounts and unless someone has absconded with the funds they will still be there. Berndale did not go broke, their licence was revoked.

Professional4X posted:
They lost their license because they didn't have the financial ability to properly handle their clients needs.
The didn't properly protect their clients money. Thus, good luck getting any money back from them.

jonpearce posted:
Where does it say they fraudulently dealt with clients funds? There would have been criminal charges laid if that was the case. You are scaremongering and certainly not making clients that had money deposited feel any better. We deal with ASIC here not SEC.

"Scaremongering" ?

Oh nice... You decided to go with the childish name calling route... Ok noted...

You want their clients who lost money to "feel better" about it?
NO. ABSOLUTELY NOT. This is not something to just "feel better" about.
This is something to be extremely pissed off about, and requires hiring an attorney to deal with the problem.

PAY ATTENTION.....


I very specifically said:

They lost their license because they didn't have the financial ability to properly handle their clients needs.
The didn't properly protect their clients money. Thus, good luck getting any money back from them.

This statement is VERY CLEARLY supported by the public announcement by the government which says (yet again) the following information.

FROM the government website:
https://asic.gov.au/about-asic/news-centre/find-a-media-release/2018-releases/18-363mr-asic-cancels-retail-otc-derivative-issuer-berndale-capital-securities-licence-and-bans-former-director/

Most specifically the following information points.

This one states they are not in compliance with financial services laws.
===>

failed to take reasonable steps to ensure that its representative complied with financial services laws;

This one states they did not have adequate financial resources (NOT ENOUGH MONEY).
===>

failed to have adequate financial and human resources;

This one states they didn't provide an appropriate method for dispute resolutions.
===>

failed to maintain an appropriate internal dispute resolution system;

And this one very clearly say's they didn't act in an honest manner when providing said services.
===>

failed to provide financial services efficiently, honestly and fairly;

And this one say's they didn't comply with the reporting requirements for client money.
===>

failed to comply with the client money reporting requirements;

And the list goes on....

ASIC did in fact state that the brokerage lost it's license for failing to provide their services in an honest manner.

There is no scaremongering here, just the facts which you are opting to ignore.

In addition if you google "berndale capital scam" you will see 11,400 search results, a large portion of these search results appear to be in regard to Berndale ignoring withdrawl requests from their clients and vast complaints that clients were being scammed out of their money.

Professional4X posted:

jonpearce posted:
I was referring to this statement you made: "Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone."

This is incorrect. Client funds are kept in segregated accounts and unless someone has absconded with the funds they will still be there. Berndale did not go broke, their licence was revoked.

Professional4X posted:
They lost their license because they didn't have the financial ability to properly handle their clients needs.
The didn't properly protect their clients money. Thus, good luck getting any money back from them.

jonpearce posted:
Where does it say they fraudulently dealt with clients funds? There would have been criminal charges laid if that was the case. You are scaremongering and certainly not making clients that had money deposited feel any better. We deal with ASIC here not SEC.

"Scaremongering" ?

Oh nice... You decided to go with the childish name calling route... Ok noted...

You want their clients who lost money to "feel better" about it?
NO. ABSOLUTELY NOT. This is not something to just "feel better" about.
This is something to be extremely pissed off about, and requires hiring an attorney to deal with the problem.

PAY ATTENTION.....


I very specifically said:

They lost their license because they didn't have the financial ability to properly handle their clients needs.
The didn't properly protect their clients money. Thus, good luck getting any money back from them.

This statement is VERY CLEARLY supported by the public announcement by the government which says (yet again) the following information.

FROM the government website:
https://asic.gov.au/about-asic/news-centre/find-a-media-release/2018-releases/18-363mr-asic-cancels-retail-otc-derivative-issuer-berndale-capital-securities-licence-and-bans-former-director/

Most specifically the following information points.

This one states they are not in compliance with financial services laws.
===>

failed to take reasonable steps to ensure that its representative complied with financial services laws;

This one states they did not have adequate financial resources (NOT ENOUGH MONEY).
===>

failed to have adequate financial and human resources;

This one states they didn't provide an appropriate method for dispute resolutions.
===>

failed to maintain an appropriate internal dispute resolution system;

And this one very clearly say's they didn't act in an honest manner when providing said services.
===>

failed to provide financial services efficiently, honestly and fairly;

And this one say's they didn't comply with the reporting requirements for client money.
===>

failed to comply with the client money reporting requirements;

And the list goes on....

ASIC did in fact state that the brokerage lost it's license for failing to provide their services in an honest manner.

There is no scaremongering here, just the facts which you are opting to ignore.

Where does ASIC say they was misappropriation of client funds? Until ASIC report that they cannot account for clients funds you ARE scaremongering.

I have been an IB for close to 10 years now and have IB agreements in place with the largest retail Forex brokers in Australia. I am yet to come across an Australian broker that has failed to pay back clients funds. It is a mistake to apply US scenarios to Australia regulations.

jonpearce posted:
Where does ASIC say they was misappropriation of client funds? Until ASIC report that they cannot account for clients funds you ARE scaremongering.

Again with the name calling. Please stop with such childish things.

jonpearce posted:
I have been an IB for close to 10 years now and have IB agreements in place with the largest retail Forex brokers in Australia. I am yet to come across an Australian broker that has failed to pay back clients funds. It is a mistake to apply US scenarios to Australia regulations.

I could care less about you being an IB for 10 years now. That means little to nothing. Just about anyone can become an IB.
In addition, this discussion has nothing to do with your history of being an IB , or whatever other nonsense you feel happens to be important yet entirely irrelevant to the discussion.

Let's stick just the facts. I am curious however, did you have an IB agreement with Berndale? If so I can see why you would hold so tight to the fantasy of "feeling better" about this and all that nonsense.

Also, I never said anything about the US, US Scenarios, or the application of said scenarios to Australia regulations. I did mention however Madoff because it was RELEVANT in regard to clients losing money and not getting it back. This could just as easily have been any number of other instances from around the world being used for examples.

Again stick to the actual topic of discussion, which is Berndale capital and the possible routes to get back any money due to said clients.

And that route is to contact the regulatory body and hire an attorney to deal with it.

There is a level Federal investigation taking place, and they have FROZEN the bank accounts and assets of the parties in question.

https://asic.gov.au/about-asic/news-centre/find-a-media-release/2018-releases/18-390mr-asic-obtains-freezing-orders-against-berndale-capital-securities-and-stavro-d-amore/


According to the information provided by the government, there appears to be a mismanagement of client funds.

ASIC is concerned that Berndale and Mr D’Amore, its former director, may have breached client money obligations, and contravened other laws.

Again, please stop with any name calling and stick to only the facts that we know.

FYI.........'scaremongering' is a verb not a noun so it cannot be 'name calling' as you said.

You made this comment "Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone."
I do not believe this is the case. What proof or inside information do you have that his "money is gone"?........absolutely none.

My years of dealing with Australian brokers has included a good understanding of the security of client funds as required by ASIC.

Yes, I had an IB agreement with Berndale in their early days which I terminated as I was not happy with the trading conditions offered.

Cool.......go (try) negotiate a few deals and let me know how you go.

jonpearce posted:
FYI.........'scaremongering' is a verb not a noun so it cannot be 'name calling' as you said.

Either way, it's still extremely childish behavior on your part, of which I asked you to please refrain from.

jonpearce posted:
You made this comment "Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone."
I do not believe this is the case. What proof or inside information do you have that his "money is gone"?........absolutely none.

Yes I posted these exact words:

Pretty much all scenarios would indicate you are out of luck and your money is gone.

I have well over 35 years of actual experience, and historically the outcome from situations where there has been mismanagement of funds and a brokerage loses it's license due to it, it is extremely difficult for clients to get back money which is owed to them. Getting their funds back could take years to accomplish, and that's only if there are enough recovered assets available.

jonpearce posted:
My years with of dealing with Australian brokers has included a good understanding of the security of client funds as required by ASIC.

Then you should already know, without me having to explain it to you, that while it's obvious that those regulations exist, there is simply no absolute guarantee that the brokerage has followed the rule of law and chosen to abide by those regulations, nor is there any guarantee that the brokerage provided for a segregation of client funds as required in order to protect said funds.

Clearly they didn't abide by the regulations as set forth, because they lost their license, and they've had their assets and accounts frozen.

jonpearce posted
Yes, I had an IB agreement with Berndale in their early days which I terminated as I was not happy with the trading conditions offered.

Interesting......

jonpearce posted
Cool.......go (try) negotiate a few deals and let me know how you go ;)

Seriously? Anyone with reasonable experience as appropriate to the markets can become an IB, it's not some secret thing, and it's not that hard to do. It can be an enormous amount of work, but becoming one is not that difficult.

Regardless though, it's also off topic..

The question was:

"Can anyone advise on how to get one's money back from this broker?"

The answer remains the same, they need to contact the regulatory agencies and hire an attorney.

Is it as childish as making ill informed blanket statements to a member who is concerned about losing his funds? I think not.

Your expertise in the IB field is as impressive as your knowledge of ASIC requirements. The first question is generally "How many clients do you have?". The answer is usually "None yet" from wannabe IB's. Stick to trading your propriety system that you refuse to share at any cost sounds the best plan or try affiliate marketing.

He doesn't need an attorney........he can submit a complaint via ASIC and AFCA at no cost. This is Australia we are talking about, the whole world does not revolve around the US.

jonpearce posted:
Is it as childish as making ill informed blanket statements to a member who is concerned about losing his funds? I think not.

Your expertise in the IB field is as impressive as your knowledge of ASIC requirements. The first question is generally "How many clients do you have?". The answer is usually "None yet" from wannabe IB's. Stick to trading your propriety system that you refuse to share at any cost sounds the best plan or try affiliate marketing.

He doesn't need an attorney........he can submit a complaint via ASIC and AFCA at no cost. This is Australia we are talking about, the whole world does not revolve around the US.

I find it interesting that you would recommend an investor who possibly got defrauded to avoid speaking with an attorney.
That alone is extremely unprofessional.

Also, I'm not some "wannabe" with 10 years IB experience.

I actually do know what I am talking about.

But regardless of my actual 35+ years experience, my answer still remains the same.

Contact the regulatory body and talk to an attorney.

End of discussion.

I have been advised through a guy who has an account that all accounts have been frozen and will be dealt with in batches over the next 6 months. Any clients who are owed money should lodge a complaint through FOS for a quicker resolution. Let's hope that this works.

Chowie posted:
I have been advised through a guy who has an account that all accounts have been frozen and will be dealt with in batches over the next 6 months. Any clients who are owed money should lodge a complaint through FOS for a quicker resolution. Let's hope that this works.

Can you please add here more info about FOS? I’m very much interested to know more from you. Thanks in advance.